S4E11: Tetris -or- Playing the Classics

Kristal (0:00): I don't know where my Genesis could be. I haven't seen my Super Nintendo since 2003. That's alright. I don't mind. I've got a switch in the old switcheroo.

Kristal (0:22): My friend Mike and J Mo too.

Unknown Speaker (0:28): Welcome to the old Switcheroo, where we talk gaming retro with Mike and J Mo. We're the often imitated, never emulated podcast diving deep into Nintendo Class six. If you like, you should like and subscribe. Today, we play Tetris and 99. Mike, let's begin because this bit's wearing thin.

Mike (0:55): It would be for the best if you introduced our guest. Alright. Well, with a musical introduction like that, I think it'll only appropriate for such a musical game that we have Jennifer Miller Hamill, who is the producer and host of Arcade on Classic California.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:14): Hello. Okay. J Mo? Fantastic. Because you know that there's a thing out there called the Tetris Opera, right, that they do on video games live?

Unknown Speaker (1:22): I know that now.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:23): Yeah. So it's a whole thing. So this is the Tetris Opera part two, my friends. I love it. It's so good.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:29): Thank you.

Unknown Speaker (1:29): I really tried hard for you. I wanted to make it special.

Unknown Speaker (1:32): Thank you. Thank you. It's fantastic.

Jaymo (1:35): And so you have a streaming show, kind of pseudo radio show about classical music.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:42): Right. So I so my my day job at classical California is that I'm the morning host there. So I'm up at the crack of dawn helping people get ready for work and get ready for school. And when I started there, it's been nine years now since I did my first show over there. And I really wanted to get more video game music on the air because they were already doing some pretty good things with, like, movie music and even some TV themes, like Game of Thrones would pop up every so often.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (2:09): But my background is classical music. I I'm I'm a singer by training. And but I've also been a gamer since I was in the single digits. So I've always loved game music, and I always thought, why don't we hear more gaming music in the concert hall or on classical radio? Because it is the classical music of today.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (2:33): And so one of my big missions when I started at Classical California was to start sneaking more video game music on the air. So I went into our system, and I was like, oh, we've got the fallout theme by Inaan Zor. And then I would sneak that on. And it's like, oh, we've got some of that, like, you know, LA London Symphony, you know, the the greatest video games music ever, you know, the CDs that had like the soldier playing the cello on the front, which has a a version of Tetris actually on there. It's a really cool like klezmer version of the Tetris theme.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (3:03): And then through that, I was able to pitch a streaming channel to them that is hosted by Classical California. You can find it on our website and our app, and I'll give the guys the information on that so you can link it in the show notes and go find it. But but it's a it's now up to twenty seven hours of video game music and classical music used in video games. And then other pieces of music that are kind of like the same vibe or might have come from composers that have worked in the gaming world, like Yupeng Chen who wrote music for Genshin Impact. We've got stuff on there that he wrote for the classical concert hall.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (3:41): But it's a chance for you to just go on, and it does act like a radio station. So you could tune in different times a day because it is such like an offset from a regular day. You can tune in in the morning and in the evening, and then the morning again the next day, and you're gonna hear a different segment of it. So it does kinda feel like a radio station. But it's called Arcade, and it's my pride and joy.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (4:00): And if you haven't heard it yet, please go check it out.

Jaymo (4:05): Yeah. I was vibing to your show last night Hey. Preparing my show notes and getting yelled at by Maestro. You have such an impeccable taste. I popped off for Tsukasa Saito's Elden Ring theme.

Unknown Speaker (4:17): Yeah.

Jaymo (4:17): And I I I played the hell out of that game. It's and and I didn't realize until your show last night, like, this has always just been the menu music, and I and my brain knew the menu music was good, but I would just be clicking past because my friends are waiting to play online.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (4:32): Right.

Jaymo (4:32): So separating it from the game, I really appreciate how beautiful that score is, and I wouldn't have had that thought if you weren't presenting them in this way. So I I gotta ask, is there a game soundtrack or a game series that has the that you think is really special to you or your go to? And, Mike, I wanna know yours too. Like, mine are the Street Fighter themes, which are not really, like, classical music, but they are kind of a bop. You know?

Jaymo (4:57): So

Unknown Speaker (4:58): Like Ken's theme? Oh my god.

Unknown Speaker (5:00): Right? So good.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (5:01): Yeah. Yeah. I mean, for me, when people ask you because I I do get this question. Like, what was it in the gaming world that really said, okay. You need to explore game music more.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (5:13): Like I said, I've been a gamer since the eighties. So, of course, I grew up playing, like, Mario, Zelda. Bubble Bobble was one of my favorites with that earworm of a theme that just gets stuck in your head over and over and over again. But when I started moving into PC gaming, it was the Myst series from, you know, all the way back in '93. That was the first time that I was playing a game, and I had to stop what I was doing.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (5:36): I was, you know, wandering around the main island. And I remember I was standing in front of the door to the library, and I just stopped. And I had to listen to what was going on, not just in the sound design with, like, the wind blowing and the the birds chirping, but then also Robin Miller's, like, just really, like, subtle atmospheric score. And it was, again, like, so subtle, but it adds just this additional layer to the, like, fabric of that game. And so when I then went from that game into Riven, when it came out a few years later, and he built on that score even more.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (6:09): It really made me sort of stop and take notice. And then so when I would go into other games like the Journeyman Project or the Longest Journey, like, all all of these, like, very, really, like, formative adventure games from the late nineties and the early aughts, like, I really was hearing what these composers were doing, and I was like, this music really stands up to anything that I would hear in my favorite movie or prestige television show. And again, so the question was, why isn't this music out there? And so now, you know, I I think about, you know, gaming series like Mass Effect. I think about, you know, Inaan Zor's work on both the Fallout series.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (6:47): Well, and, you know, his work in dragon age, and then of course in starfield. Say what you want about starfield. The score is great. And then of course, you know, anything that composer Jessica Curry touches is gorgeous. She wrote the score for a game called everybody's gone to the rapture, which is this walking sim where you're in a little town in England.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (7:07): And it's like the rapture, everybody just gets up and disappears. And you have to explore the town and piece together the mystery to find out what happened. And it's this beautiful choral score, so there's lots of English folk song and singers on it, but it's all original music. Like, she did some stuff where she, based on an existing English folk song, but then she, like, left off from that. Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (7:27): And yeah. So, like, I show these scores to people who are like, oh, video game music is just, you know, bleeps bloops, electric guitars. And I'm like, but you haven't heard Jessica Curry.

Jaymo (7:37): There you go. There you go. Mike, what's your answer?

Unknown Speaker (7:40): I mean, see, now I feel like it's gonna be Bleeps and bloops?

Jaymo (7:43): No. He's like Sonic Spinball.

Mike (7:47): I actually was I I would say the one that I would drive around to, I'd have a Cruise in USA.

Jaymo (7:54): Yeah. The Cruise in USA arcade. And, Jen, forget a little of this. This is how clever Mike is. He had, like, this huge playlist of, like, 500 songs, and every so often, he'd throw in the checkpoint because so because that it's a four second soundtrack.

Jaymo (8:07): But as Mike's driving, he's like, oh, I passed Best Buy. There must have been a checkpoint in this track.

Mike (8:13): I had a lot more music than that. And so what I had done was I just add and I just had all of my music on shuffle. Mhmm. And I just had, like, two or 300 copies of that in the playlist. So they would just, every so often, shuffle its way through there, and it was great.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (8:29): See, that's what I'm missing from arcade. I need to throw some checkpoints in every once in a while. That's what's going on.

Unknown Speaker (8:34): There you

Mike (8:34): go. The one other customer that I think is more modern and so I won't say more sophisticated, but it feels slightly more on par with some of the things you're talking about, would be the main music for Halo. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (8:50): Oh, yeah. Yeah. A 100%.

Jaymo (8:55): That was a whole moment. The Gregorian chanting. Is it Gregorian chanting? Jennifer, you would know.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (9:00): It's it's Gregorian ish. So I I've had the opportunity to sing on a few of the video games live concerts. And I remember when they first handed us that score and I got to because it's really it's for men, but they told the women. They're like, if you wanna sing it down in the men's octave, feel free. And so it's like, challenge accepted.

Unknown Speaker (9:19): But I just want to do that like,

Jennifer Miller Hammel (9:20): oh, thing there at the beginning. And I was like, oh my god. This is so amazing. It was that. And then when they give us gave us the heaven shall tremble from Diablo.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (9:31): Oh. The pop pop pop pop thing. I just remember getting to sing that too, and that was just quite fantastic.

Unknown Speaker (9:37): So hype. So hype.

Mike (9:38): So I wanted to also ask you, beyond the arcade stuff is that you you also have been at, like, video game conferences and stuff

Unknown Speaker (9:47): Mhmm.

Mike (9:48): Talking about video game music. And I was kinda wondering what is the specific part of that intersection of video games and music and video game music as a topic that you are focused on?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (10:00): Well, a couple of things. For me, I really like sort of digging into why this music as a as a listener, what is it about this music that tickles that nostalgia button for us? Like, what is it that gets us so emotionally invested in the musical side of it? Because if you've ever been to a video game music concert, whether it's something like video games live where they play from a bunch of different franchise, or if you go to something like the Dream Worlds Orchestra where they play Final Fantasy pieces. And that is another one, by the way.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (10:30): Final Fantasy music is just that's a whole that's a whole world. But what is it about that emotional connection that gets that audience so stirred up? It's you go to a concert hall and it's like you're at a rock show because people get so excited. So I like focusing on that. And then I also to the other side of that particular thing with talking about orchestras playing this music, how can I sort of demystify the idea that this music is not as worthy of being performed in a concert hall to classical organizations?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (11:06): What is it that I can do as an advocate for this music, for these composers, for these franchises? How can I go and speak up for them to organizations like the Los Angeles Chamber Orchestra or the LA Phil or the San Francisco Symphony to convince them that these composers need to be heard alongside the music of Stravinsky and Ravel and Beethoven? Because while it's great that some places like the San Francisco Symphony have started doing video game themed concerts, I feel like, yes, that is a step forward. But I also feel like a piece of gaming music if you've ever been to the Hollywood Bowl, the Hollywood Bowl usually, they'll have like, if you go to one of their classical nights, they'll have, like, a flavor piece that will start the show. So it's usually like a world premiere from a new composer or something more modern, and then they'll play the big masterworks.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (12:00): Why can't that flavor piece at the beginning of the show be a piece by Austen Wintery? You know? Why why can't we put something from sort of the sea on there? Especially since it just won a Grammy. Right?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (12:13): Like, that that should be a way to, like, integrate something from the gaming world into a regular classical concert. So I I I feel like that as as someone who understands and has feet in both of these worlds, that I can be an advocate and a voice for these two worlds trying to find a way to come together to to finally cross that bridge and understand that it is not a scary thing. It's actually good for these organizations to explore the world of game music.

Jaymo (12:41): Yeah. It's it's a crucial part of the games as art discussion. You know? And and I and I think you're doing such a good service, you know, to the gaming community, know, both as a group and as, like, an academic pursuit because just now we're seeing people become adults having grown up with these things.

Unknown Speaker (12:56): Mhmm.

Jaymo (12:57): And so we don't have sort of a sneer about it. Like, we kind of understand that gaming is a part of of growing up and it's part of our lives. And so that's why I I I think it's really cool what you're doing.

Unknown Speaker (13:08): Thank you.

Mike (13:09): Is this something that movie music had to go through as well? Because, like, the Hollywood Bowl, like, for years has been having, like, John Williams. And I'm curious because at this point, it feels like sort of anyone would say it doesn't seem out of place for the LA Philharmonic to be playing this music from Star Wars or something and kind of no one seems to question that. Was was this a process that had to happen for film previously that it's just that video games music is now doing that same thing that film music would have had to do at some point, or was that more readily accepted?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (13:44): I think it was something that movie music had to go through. Definitely. Because I I I was fortunate that I had a very musical family, so we used to go to performances a lot. And I remember growing up in the eighties, if you went to a classical concert hall, you wouldn't see Bernard Herrmann or Miklos Rosa or John Williams, of course, you know, in his eighties heyday. You wouldn't have seen any of that on a regular concert season.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (14:11): But I think what happened and what changed was John Williams being the director of the Boston pops. And when his music started to become associated with these huge tentpole films that were just universally loved, and he would start putting some of that music on his concerts, and then he was tapped to write themes for the the LA Olympics back in the eighties. And I I I wanna say, like, besides, like, Enya Marconi and Bernard Herrmann, he was one of the first composers that really came to superstardom through his work in the movie world. And so I and plus just the fact that if you put that music on its own, take take it away from Indiana Jones, take it away from Superman. It is just really good music.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (14:58): Like, you can't help but listen to the march from Superman and just be like, hell yeah. I'm gonna take on the day. It's just such a good, good piece of music. And I think that's what classical organizations were starting to realize at that point, that this music can be separated from the media that it was written for, and it still has emotional impact. It still tells a story.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (15:22): And I think today, audiences again, you know, people who are programming classical concerts are starting to understand that with gaming music. I mean, there is a lot of soundtrack music out there that is very much that. It is just musical wallpaper because that is what you're supposed to have in a movie or a video game. But they're also starting to recognize composers like Austin Wintory who can write incredible music that stands on its own away from games like Journey and Sword of the Sea and The Pathless and Assassin's Creed Syndicate, is just a great score. So I think now that orchestras are more open to the idea, I do think we're gonna be seeing more of it.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (16:03): But I do think in terms of game music in particular, there's still a really long way to go. And maybe we'll turn that corner in the next ten years. I don't know. I would like to think so. But I think also, again, as we, you know, people who grew up playing video games are getting into this more, like, leadership oriented space, we might be seeing more of that in the future.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (16:22): Fingers crossed. There's always a chance, but but we'll see.

Unknown Speaker (16:27): That'd be cool. That'd be cool. Mhmm. Well, my friends, these blocks aren't gonna pile up on their own. Are you guys ready to do some lines?

Unknown Speaker (16:35): Yeah. Align

Jaymo (16:35): down, Mike. Calm down, Mike. Nice. So let's begin our discussion of the Tetris series first released on the Game Boy in 1989. According to Nintendo classics, Tetris, the iconic block sliding puzzle game is here.

Jaymo (16:54): Easy to pick up, yet impossible to put down. Create solid horizontal lines by deftly maneuvering I love the word deft. Love that word. Deftly maneuvering the falling oh, okay. Tetraminos?

Jaymo (17:07): Did I nail it in one? How do you say that word, Mike? It's not tetriminos. It's tetronum.

Mike (17:13): I think I would say tet tetriminos, but I'm

Unknown Speaker (17:16): Yeah. I would say tetriminos.

Unknown Speaker (17:17): Would you?

Jaymo (17:18): Yeah. Alright. Tetriminos into place. Clear as many lines as possible. Fourth screen is overrun with tetriminos or however you say it.

Jaymo (17:25): Work your way up from the easiest setting or crank up the speed to increase the challenge. Either way, you're in store for hours of entertainment all over again. In one player games, you can choose between two modes, a type, where you keep clearing lines until it's game over, or b type, where you aim for a high score with a limited number of lines. And in competitive two player games, you win by either being first to clear 30 lines or stacking your opponents to trauma nose. I like mine better.

Jaymo (17:49): All the way to the top. So Mike had the fun idea of covering four games for our Tetris series. We're gonna be stacking OG Tetris on the Game Boy against Tetris on the NES, Tetris DX on the Game Boy Color, and finishing with the combo with Tetris 99 on Nintendo Switch online. Rather than having four separate box art discussions, I think we should compare them in a little Tetris boxing match. So you guys have any thoughts on the packaging of these games?

Jaymo (18:20): Oh,

Jennifer Miller Hammel (18:22): I mean, I can tell you with Tetris DX. I'm a big fan of space shuttles. You know, again, growing up in the eighties.

Unknown Speaker (18:28): Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (18:29): Gosh. But I don't know. There's something about the original Tetris Game Boy box that just excites me. Because I would I I knew when I was at Toys R Us, I had found the gaming section when I saw Tetris.

Unknown Speaker (18:41): Why are tilting your head like that, Jennifer?

Unknown Speaker (18:43): Oh, I don't know. Maybe it's because I'm trying to trying to look at it because it's it's sort of stacked in in a turned configuration, sort of like tetriminos.

Unknown Speaker (18:55): It was driving me insane that neither of you were acknowledging that I rotated the images. Uh-huh.

Unknown Speaker (19:00): Yeah. Because if I didn't acknowledge it, then I wouldn't have to make that happen on the video.

Unknown Speaker (19:05): No. Wait. Wait. Can't no. Show show it like this.

Unknown Speaker (19:08): Like

Jaymo (19:09): Plenty of people have talked about the Tetris box art, Mike. Nobody has been stupid or brilliant enough to talk about the Tetris box art rotated. But I I do agree. I think that Jennifer's right. So the Tetris on the NES and Game Boy had more or less identical box arts.

Jaymo (19:25): You have the the Tetramanos falling from the heavens, kinda towards the customer at an angled look. And then the Game Boy Color sequel, same kind of concept, but you have the space imagery of the sort of space race element of this. Tetris 99, I think, is kind of cool in the way that it's showing off the gameplay mechanic of seeing your 98 other opponents in the background. But, Mike, I'm gonna predict. I think you like the original Game Boy one the best.

Mike (19:54): I think so just because it it's simplest. Although, what is a really interesting thing to notice here, I feel like all depictions of this show a bunch of the blocks falling at once, which is not how the game works.

Jaymo (20:07): No. No. It's one at a time. But, I mean, it's more exciting that way. It's like a rain of blocks.

Jaymo (20:14): I thought you were gonna appreciate the tagline from Russia with fun.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (20:18): Okay. I was about to say that. Yeah. I had forgotten that was on there. From Russia with fun.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (20:23): That's great. And then I also love how they've got the little, like, oh, by the way, you can sit really close to someone else with a cable and play this two player sticker on there with the game link. That's right.

Jaymo (20:34): It was one of the very first. It was, like, Mahjong was first, and this might have been, like, the second or third game Mhmm. That was mobile. So, Mike, you have something fun from the history of Tetris. You've found a review of the original game.

Jaymo (20:49): I'll just let you explain it.

Mike (20:51): This is a 2008 review of Tetris that is talking about the original game, but I just it's a wonderful review. This is from wish I could read my own notes better. I think this is Objective Ministries.

Unknown Speaker (21:05): Okay. Is that a website? Yes.

Mike (21:08): Okay. It'll be a nice counterpoint to how Nintendo describes what Tetris is. Tetris is an action puzzle game where the player rotates falling block shapes to make them fit together in a pile. When a row is filled, it disappears, keeping the height of the pile of blocks from increasing. As the game progresses, it continually speeds up until the player starts making mistakes that allow the blocks to reach the top of the game area ending the game.

Mike (21:34): Tetris is unwinnable. You can only put off your inevitable defeat. This fatalistic aspect of the game should come as no surprise since it was originally created in 1985 in the Soviet Union where the atheist government taught everyone that there is nothing but a bleak, pointless existence followed by death with no chance for salvation. It is claimed that the word Tetris comes from the game pieces all being made of four blocks. In reality, the game was named in mockery of the trinity by adding a fourth hypostasis, the communist state to the father, son, and the holy ghost.

Mike (22:05): Because it is simple to program, versions of Tetris can be found in every game, computer, and operating system. There have even been implementations of Tetris done under computer controlled lights in office buildings, turning the lighted windows into the falling blocks. The ubiquity of Tetris is also because it is highly addictive. Its repetitive gameplay and use of a repetitive Russian folk tune causes players to slip into a hypnagogic state, making them receptive to the communistic themes inherent in the game imagery. Everyone is an individualistic block that must be made to fit together in Soviet conformity, and sometimes whole lines of people are made to disappear without any explanation.

Mike (22:44): This is intentional since, like all work done by the Soviet Academy of Science where Tetris was developed, it was part of secret military research, in this case having to do with mind control. The US military also researched mind controlled video games in the 1980s, one called Polybus, but we never used them during the Cold War unlike the Soviets who unleashed Tetris into the general public where it's still affecting people to this day. Because of its fatalistic worldview and the danger it poses to people's god given free will, all implementations of Tetris get zero crosses. Wow.

Unknown Speaker (23:20): Oh. Well, that's a hot take on Tetris, my friends.

Unknown Speaker (23:25): That wasn't in the manual, Mike? I don't believe it was.

Jaymo (23:30): You know what I love about that whole thing is that it all hinges that whole conspiracy theory hinges on the idea that Tetris is unwinnable. Like so just imagine him learning that and just him. I'm gonna assume him. Okay. That might be problematic, but that felt that felt him y.

Unknown Speaker (23:52): I'm I'm not gonna argue with you.

Jaymo (23:53): So yeah. Wow, Mike. Thank you so much. We'll just put a giant asterisk on this section

Unknown Speaker (23:59): of the video and call it allegedly, but

Jaymo (24:02): holy hell. Well, that's way more fun than my behind the scenes trivia. Tetris has been one of the easiest retro games for me to research. First of all, Apple released a Tetris historical black comedy thriller starring Taron Edgerton. Friends of the show Nate Brown from MidHunter said is decidedly not mid.

Jaymo (24:21): Have either of you seen this one?

Unknown Speaker (24:22): I haven't, actually.

Mike (24:24): I haven't because it's on Apple.

Jaymo (24:26): Oh, okay. Well, leave a comment if you like it. And, Nate, if you're listening, chime in. Let us know what you liked about Much to my delight, tetris.com also has a lengthy fun fact section where I picked up most of these gems. According to the 2014 Guinness Book of World Records, Tetris was the first video game in outer space when cosmonaut Alexander Sarabov brought his Game Boy to the M I M I MIR Space Station in 1993.

Jaymo (24:52): MiR. Okay. What does it stand for? MiR.

Unknown Speaker (24:56): Yeah. I just know it as MiR.

Unknown Speaker (24:58): Yeah. I was gonna say, thought that

Unknown Speaker (25:00): You don't think it's an acronym? I I in my in my notes, it says all caps, and I'm an English teacher.

Mike (25:04): So Yeah. No. Sometimes I just do it. One of them means it's just, like, village something along lines, like, village or something in Russian, but that might have been the other one.

Unknown Speaker (25:15): Peace or world is what it is.

Jaymo (25:17): Yes. Okay. Well, they brought it to the Mir Space Station in 1993. The 2017 Guinness World Record book also credits Tetris as the video game with the most officially licensed versions ever released. Across 65 different platforms, how many different versions of Tetris do you think have been released to date?

Jaymo (25:36): Okay, Ray. Price is Right rules. I want both your guesses closest without going over. 65 different platforms. How many versions of the game have been officially released?

Unknown Speaker (25:45): I'm gonna say 250.

Unknown Speaker (25:48): 250. K. Mike? I'm gonna say 85.

Jaymo (25:53): Jennifer was way closer. 234. Really close. Wow. You got that musician brain.

Unknown Speaker (26:00): You got the math

Unknown Speaker (26:00): in here, and I saw

Jaymo (26:01): you chugging. In 2019, Alex Trebek had mustache and egg on his face when he read an infamously incorrect Tetris clue that names the Tetris pieces as Orange, Ricky, Hero, and smash boy. According to polygon.com, these names were a viral joke from Twitter user, Vachetto, who had photoshopped them into pages of the NES manual, and the Jeopardy researchers fell for it.

Mike (26:27): Does have a little bit of a Thomas was afraid kind of vibe there.

Unknown Speaker (26:32): I'm not smart enough to get your jokes, but that's okay.

Mike (26:35): It it it's a indie game where, like, all the characters are basically, like, basic polygons.

Unknown Speaker (26:41): Oh, okay.

Mike (26:43): They have names and stuff, but it's Right. That one's a square. That one's a rectangle.

Jaymo (26:47): Got you. Got you. And then speaking of mistakes, tetris dot com is actually outdated. Okay. So Tetris, you You listening?

Jaymo (26:54): Tetris? Okay. Update your website. It credits Drexel University for creating the largest video game in history when in 2014, they used LEDs on the 29 story, Citrus Center to make a playable skyscraper version, but this record was smashed by Red Bull in 2025 when they used over 2,000 drones to project a playable Tetris board over the Dubai skyline. Tetris creator Aleksey Pajitnov, I think is how you say it, is quoted as saying, one of my biggest dreams has been to see it played with drones, so I'm thrilled to see that dream come to life.

Jaymo (27:27): I think that's the weird dream. Right, Jen? Like, I wanna see my creation in drone form.

Unknown Speaker (27:35): I mean, what better way to see your name in lights, though. Right?

Unknown Speaker (27:39): Wow. Okay.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (27:40): Yeah. Like Yeah. I kinda I I would love is that is that Blue Scootie sitting there playing it, or or no? No. I don't think it is.

Unknown Speaker (27:48): I I I would love to to get my hands on this. Like, this picture's fantastic.

Jaymo (27:54): It's amazing. We'll link the whole article, in the show notes. So before we get into the joy pros and joy cons of each Tetris game for today, what's our general history with the Tetris franchise? I mean, for, like, me, my dad had this for free with, like, Windows 93, and I had Tetris on, like, my first flip phone. But I've never been very good at it, so I never really got into it.

Jaymo (28:16): And I've played the most Tetris for sure for this episode. Mike, what about you? What's your what's your Tetris history as a series?

Mike (28:23): It's definitely something where I I've either played it or things that are relatively similar to it. Like, back on Windows 3.1, we had something that was, like, a three d sort of version called blocks.

Unknown Speaker (28:38): Okay.

Mike (28:39): Blocks three d or something, which Yeah. Sticks with me. And, of course, just it's on so many things that it is something that would play. So foreshadowing something that if you weren't gonna plan on talking about, I was at least gonna work in was, like, I think I've reached what I sort of was probably the kill screens on things that were not meant to play high speed gaming.

Unknown Speaker (28:59): Okay.

Mike (28:59): Like, I think I did that on a graphing calculator. The calculator's like, whoop, we're done because it can only do so much. And I definitely remember playing Tetris on a flight to Australia twenty years ago where I hit a point where just it couldn't react to button presses fast enough. And I can't remember being like, I'm kind of annoyed about this, but all things being equal, I suppose the processing power should mostly be going to keeping the plane in the air. So I'm not gonna complain that, like, the thing in the back of the seat is not as fast as I would like it to be at this point.

Jaymo (29:38): I I assume this was, like, on your phone,

Unknown Speaker (29:40): but you were playing on the plane. Yeah. On the plane architecture. That's pretty dope, Mike. I wonder

Jaymo (29:47): if that's included in that list of all the published versions. So Jennifer, Tetris, what's your what's your story?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (29:54): I have a pretty deep history with Tetris. I so my dad was in the service. I'll start with that. So we used to move around a lot. And one year, we actually had to move in the middle of a school year.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (30:07): And so my parents bribed me to be okay to move in the middle of my sixth grade year with gifting me a Game Boy. So that was kind of like and and and I'm talking the original Game Boy with the green screen and which came with Tetris. And so I used to sit in the back seat of my parents' Plymouth Voyager and play Tetris all the time on car trips. And then so that that that was really, like, my main feed for Tetris. But then I had some babysitting charges when I was in middle school that had the NES version.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (30:43): So after I would put them to bed, I would go downstairs and play their NES for, you know, hours while waiting for mom and dad to get home. And then my mom also had Tetris for Windows on her computer. So we had it we had two versions. We had the Windows 3.1 version, which didn't have any music on it. It was just the sound effects.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (31:07): But my mom would sit there and try to sing the Tetris theme because she would hear it on my Game Boy when I would play it there. And then we also had the DOS version, which actually if you've ever seen screenshots of the DOS version of Tetris, it's pretty, like, it's pretty in-depth. Like, it's got all these really cool they almost look like like hand drawn Russian folklore pictures. And then they have music. I didn't know it at the time.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (31:31): I know now. But the music that's in those games actually comes from Russian opera, which is pretty cool. But so if you if you have a DOS machine out there and you really wanna do, like, some deep dive into Tetris history, I encourage you to seek out Tetris. It's Tetris classic, I think, is what they call it now, but it's for it's for DOS. It's pretty cool.

Unknown Speaker (31:53): I'm looking at pictures. I'm like, this is sick.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (31:55): It's pretty rad. Yeah. It kinda reminds me, like, a bit of, like, if you took, like, battle chest from DOS and then you, like, wanted to make sort of the Tetris equivalent of it. That's what it reminded me of.

Mike (32:05): I would bet it's relatively accessible because at this point, you can play a lot of the old DOS games online that people Simulator. Sites for those. So you don't even have to do the work of figuring out how to play it on your machine. You can just go someplace and play that stuff. Because I've done that for various things that I remember from, like, elementary school where it's like, we never owned this.

Mike (32:25): I just got to play it half an hour a week. And so I saw the first half hour of this game a lot. Right.

Jaymo (32:33): I was dumb when you said DOS version. I saw that when this game was first programmed, you know, back in the eighties, he didn't have shapes. It was just characters.

Unknown Speaker (32:42): Right.

Jaymo (32:42): It was like, you know, little hashtags, each one representing a block. So that's what I expected was the DOS version. I think you know what I mean? Like so I was like, oh, this is much better looking.

Mike (32:53): This is back the era where very second, where you could just have just DOS, but also where it's even if you had Windows, you would start the computer up, and then you would start Windows.

Unknown Speaker (33:02): Yeah. Right.

Mike (33:02): Right. I I missed that.

Jaymo (33:06): So let's go through our four games for today. We're gonna kinda do what the joy pros and joy cons of each one, what we like, what maybe we don't like about it. And then after that, we will talk about high scores, Mike, and then whether or not we've beaten it. So the first drop puzzler game ever. Right?

Jaymo (33:26): It created a genre for a reason. It's like Tetris is so simple that even with no one explaining to you how to play it, you could just fiddle with it and figure it out, you know, in the first thirty seconds to a minute of playing it. It's just so incredibly intuitive. But I look at the screen and what strikes me is that there's things that you wouldn't think they would get on the first version of the game, like the little preview of what block is coming up next. That's just so elegant and and so simple that you'd think that would be in, like, the next version of the game, and someone would complain about, oh, you can't tell.

Jaymo (34:00): And it's like, no. He was just, like, on top of it like that. And I think that there is just a visceral satisfaction with, like, when something fits perfectly into place. Right? It's actually, I guess, called the Tetris effect, that satisfaction of, like, when you put a book on the shelf and there's just enough room for the book to fit, and you get that little dopamine hit of, like, oh, yeah.

Jaymo (34:20): Or, like, a good lock click. You know? There's something just very primal about these blocks and how good it feels to clear them away. I just think, you know, I I I just wanna give it its flowers. It's such an ingenious design.

Jaymo (34:36): But this music, Jen, can you lead us on a discussion of the original Tetris music?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (34:41): Alright. So this is, yeah, this is Tetris from the Game Boy, which was released in July 1989. So, yeah, you had you had three choices of music, and this was kind of a theme throughout the early versions, at least for Nintendo, of of Tetris. You would have three different pieces of music you could choose from before you went in, or no music at all. You could do that too, which I always found to be really boring.

Unknown Speaker (35:04): Yeah. Who would do that?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (35:05): Yeah. Right? So so music a is the classic Tetris theme, Korobainiki, which is a Russian folk song about, I and I wrote it down here because I just wanna make sure that I've got my notes correct. So it's the Peddler song. So it's about like a guy who is striking a business deal with a woman.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (35:28): And, you know, on the surface, the two of them are striking a deal over goods. But we're not talking about physical goods here. It's actually more of a folk song about, you know, other things, which I won't get into.

Unknown Speaker (35:40): Physical things?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (35:41): Yeah. Physical physical goods, my friends. But I think what I loved about this particular song being chosen, for and this was actually it was chosen by one of Nintendo's, music guys at the time. This wasn't a thing that picked to put on there. It was actually Hirokazu Tanaka, who was part of the Nintendo music team, shows this particular melody because it was just so catchy.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (36:05): And it was one that they could just loop and loop and loop and loop over and over and over again and then be able to build upon. So you got music a right there, which we all know. You have music b, which is, an original work that Tanaka wrote for both this version and the NES version, which we'll get into a little bit later. But it's a Russian style kind of dance. So it it has like, and that was the one that I usually picked when I played because I liked the sort of, like, go get it ness of the melody.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (36:37): It just felt really, really exciting. And also when you would get to the levels where you would start running out of space and the music would speed up, that's when I would like that one I thought sounded the best, when it got really, really fast. And then music c. Music c is where we sort of get into the more, like, classical world. So music c is actually Johann Sebastian Bach.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (37:00): So you've got a a a German Austrian composer on a Russian game, and it is the minuet from his French suite, which is not really French music. But it's this very, like, proper baroque sounding minuet. And and because I was also I was studying piano at this point. So occasionally, I would put this one on too. And what I love is that when I was doing my research on this particular piece, I saw someone in the comments on the YouTube video had put sort of a conversation with their parents where they were like, you know, you can't play video games in this fancy restaurant.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (37:35): And then the guy responds by putting on music c on Tetris. Or or you, like, play Tetris with your pinky up, you know, that kind

Unknown Speaker (37:42): of thing. Amazing.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (37:44): But I love the fact that, like, Nintendo's music team recognized that, you know, the this game was definitely gonna be one that was gonna go not just to their young gamers, but probably to, you know, an older audience as well. And that they found this opportunity to work this very classy music into the game. It was just and and and, of course, it becomes earworms, you know, as you listen to it over and over.

Mike (38:04): Bee was the one that I was digging into and had seen because I'm like, is this also a thing? Because the other two are. And finding some people referring it to as that it's original but inspired by a Russian folk song called, like, Bradinsky, and then I started digging down that. And it appears that, in fact, that is people corrupting a theory that it was the Atari version had music by Brad Fuller, which was, I think, original music meant to sound Russian. And the suggestion was that b is basically a reinterpretation or inspired by that specific work.

Unknown Speaker (38:44): Okay.

Mike (38:44): And I do not remotely know music well enough to listen to things and be like, yeah. No. That I can see that that is the case. But it was just interesting where I'm like, oh, someone said this this Russian folk song. Who did that who did the Russian folk song?

Mike (38:57): And then it's like, wait. No. No. That's not a that's not what that is. This is all convoluted.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (39:03): Well, and of course, this was, of course, like the wild wild west of gay music at the time too where, you know, people could lift from someone else and be like, oh, they're not gonna know.

Unknown Speaker (39:11): Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (39:11): Who's playing the Atari at this point anyway? Like

Mike (39:14): Yeah. And when you talk about this of kind of just saying, like, we're just gonna take classical music and put this in here to draw us back on movies, Weirdly, what this reminded me of in a sense of this way of certainly, at least with the first one and then also using the Bach where this is like this is existing music that we're just gonna use in such a way that it almost becomes that becomes heavily associated with this. Yeah. Actually does remind me of early film when they were doing this and something like and this is an influence because I was just at Universal's fan nights, and they have some stuff with Universal Classic Monsters. And I just hear Swan Lake, and I'm like, Dracula's somewhere nearby now.

Mike (39:51): And I think that one is not so much now for most people, but that this thing of, like, this is definitely it's music from one thing, and we have taken it, and it is going to be heavily associated with this other thing. Not in a thematic way, just in how we've used it.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (40:05): Yeah. A 100%. I mean, you see that in Five Nights at Freddy's. I mean, you know that Freddy is nearby when you start hearing the toreadors from Carmen. It's that, like, weird creepy music box version that they put in there.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (40:17): So it's funny when I hear you know, when I play that music, because we we play concert versions of the music from Carmen a lot on the air, and sometimes, like, a kid will write in. He'll be like, hey. Play that music from Five Nights at Freddy's. And I'll be like, what? Which one?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (40:30): Oh, yeah. Toriador. Duh.

Jaymo (40:32): That's like when a kid says, like, oh, Goku. He's from Fortnite. And it's like, no. No. But wild though that you brought up the Toriador because so shout out to Jeremy from Ultra Dolphin Revolution.

Jaymo (40:46): He he jumped on Nintendo Switch online with me just about half an hour ago so I could try these multiplayer modes. Because I tried to play with my wife on my Switch and my Switch too. Not to brag, Jen, but I have a Switch and a Switch too. What? And but you can't play with yourself on Nintendo.

Jaymo (41:03): But I tried to I tried to play with myself on the two different Switches, and it said, no. No. We know it's still you on the other console. So I needed I needed somebody to join me. And the two player mode on the original Tetris is actually kinda cute because player one is Mario and player two is Luigi.

Unknown Speaker (41:22): That's right.

Jaymo (41:22): And when one player wins and one player loses, they're treated to different cut scenes. One is the winner is looking at the camera, all celebrating, and then the on the other screen is looking away from the camera dejected. But if you put them side by side, you see both angles of the same sad or inspiring shot. And when player two is in danger, it plays the Toreador song. So what's what what is the you said it's from Carmen.

Jaymo (41:49): Right. But it's story wise, when is that used?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (41:52): So it's so the Toreador in Carmen, he's this like super celebrity bullfighter. He's very handsome. He's very charismatic. At this point in the opera, Carmen has already sort of tricked a young soldier into falling in love with her, and he's left his entire family to go off with her. She's gotten kinda bored, and she also kind of is getting a hint that, like, this soldier Don Jose is not quite all there mentally.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (42:20): So her attention start to turn to Toreador, who's this big celebrity. And so every time he enters, it's like, bump bump bump bump bump bump bump bump bump So he has this big and he's you know, girls follow him all around. He's got his entourage. He has this very triumphant music that he comes in with. So I think it's funny that it's used as the player danger music.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (42:41): Because yeah. I mean, in some ways, it is sort of like Carmen danger music because that her turning her attention to the Tory Door is what kind of starts her downfall in the story of the opera. Yeah.

Jaymo (42:51): Okay. Kinda ominous. Yeah. Anything we didn't like about this one? I mean, it's a hardware limitation, so you can't really fault it.

Jaymo (42:58): But I do think that of the versions we have on Nintendo Switch online, Nintendo Classics, you know, this being just on that green screen, my brain does have a harder time reacting to what piece I'm dealing with because they're all kind of diff different shades of gray on green. And in the NES and Game Boy Color versions, my brain was like, okay. I know that shade of red. That's that z's piece. And I'm already kinda planning where I'm gonna put it without I don't know.

Jaymo (43:27): It just personally for me, the lack of color made my brain just that much slower. And as Mike said, when you get high up in this game, every millisecond counts. So I did even though it's unfair to hold against the Game Boy, I did miss color in this version. Like, you don't seem

Mike (43:44): to care, though. No. Because it's the shapes that matter. I mean, we'll talk talk about the NES. Like, that changes colors as you go.

Mike (43:52): Honestly, though, I think the biggest thing here to return back on the music more, I didn't know until we did this that it's not that, like, I cannot pronounce the Russian version of the Tetris theme. Was not the Tetris theme for a Punch of the Games, But it so it it is here. It's not on it's not on the NES. It's not on the DX one.

Unknown Speaker (44:19): Mm-mm.

Mike (44:20): So, honestly, one of the strongest points simply is that does feel so iconic to Tetris, and this is the one that has it while you're playing it. So, like, that is its own selling point. Because, like, just to, like, to loop back to that, like, it's weird to discover it has lyrics in a sense only because my brain, while playing it, is going through the lyrics of it in the form of I wrote down what this thing was called. The Complete History of The Soviet Union arranged to the melody of of Tetris by someone on on YouTube. Pig with the face of a boy is the YouTube account.

Mike (44:58): I think it's the original one, where it's this really well done video that is it is that music, and it's the history of Russia. And so it's like, I am the man who assembles the blocks from up above. And it kind of goes through the stages of Russian history with the theme still being, you know, the blocks falling from the sky kind of stuff, but as, like, Russia has changed. And I have those words in my head. May simply be, I don't think I played this version of Tetris much, so I've still associated Tetris and the Tetris music strongly.

Unknown Speaker (45:33): Mhmm.

Mike (45:34): Yeah. And in that same vein, like, the other thing comes to mind. It touches back to taking video game music a bit more seriously is something that was somewhere from the vaguely early two thousands, and it's that it's that point where I have no idea when it actually occurred. And it's now just like, well, it ended up on YouTube at this point in time, but that's not when it where it's from. So it's older to some unknown amount was the University of Wisconsin had an acapella group called Redefined that did Nintendo acapella, and they picked that Tetris music, and it's great.

Mike (46:09): So an element of the Game Boy thing simply is that has the version of the music that and not to say that the other versions are not good. It's just if I really wanted to feel like I am playing Tetris, this one's actually one of the only options, which is it feels really weird.

Jaymo (46:26): Yeah. If it doesn't feel like Tetris without that Tetris theme. And and, Jen, you're gonna love this. The acapella group Mike was talking about on stage, they put their arms in the shapes of the pieces and, like, kinda just slowly crouched so the audience was seeing human Tetris kinda playing out in front of them. It's fantastic.

Mike (46:43): Yeah. It's it's incredible. And I think because they introduce it as we're gonna do some original Japanese music, and then it's just a medley of Nintendo music. Technically, is the one that's not so much an original piece from Japan, but it's like, you know, this is bit of an art piece we're gonna do.

Unknown Speaker (46:59): It's Tetris.

Mike (47:00): It's Tetris and Mario and Mortal Kombat and Zelda and Doctor Mario, which is the one that I never knew, and they don't do it. I I guess I don't know how you gesture like a doctor. And so that's the one like, they do that bit, and they don't I'm like, I have no idea what that is. And it wasn't until we played it a couple seasons ago. I was like, oh, there we go.

Mike (47:20): That's what that is.

Jaymo (47:23): So, let's do high score and thirty nine years ago. Mike, score competition here. Jen, I've you did have you ever written down your most lines cleared in a Tetris game?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (47:35): I mean, I could give you an estimate. It was probably like oh, no. I probably couldn't even give you an estimate. No. I actually have not.

Jaymo (47:41): You probably beat mine. So game type a, which is just the marathon how long you can last, Mike, my best run was 78 lines. On the Game Boy? On the Game Boy.

Mike (47:52): I did not play as much on the Game Boy. So I think my my best on there was only in the forties before I switched over to the other game modes.

Jaymo (48:01): Okay. Okay. But I'm gonna give myself second place because Jen had this in the backseat of the car growing up. There's no way you didn't get crazy good at this.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (48:08): Yeah. I mean, I I I would say, like, the only thing I didn't like about this version of Tetris was that it was so hard to find someone else who had it so we could do a two player mode or someone who hadn't lost the cable. Yeah. The multi so it was it was kind of a novelty when I was able to actually do the two player mode.

Jaymo (48:24): If you have a Nintendo Switch, we can play sometime like an online play. I just Jeremy and I just did it. So the question then is have either of you ever beaten Tetris on the Game Boy?

Unknown Speaker (48:34): No. Okay. Mike? I mean, you can beat b. You can

Unknown Speaker (48:40): beat b. So that's what I'm asking.

Mike (48:42): Yeah. Yes. Because that that's not that much.

Jaymo (48:45): Well, so are we counting anyone who's finished b or anyone who's finished b and gotten the best ending? What do we consider beating? What do we consider beating Tetris?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (48:53): Then I have b b, but yes.

Unknown Speaker (48:55): Alright. She intended Minigam.

Unknown Speaker (48:58): I'm in computer. And, Mike? I don't know what the end what what you mean by the the best ending.

Jaymo (49:04): So mode b has some presets that you select at the beginning. And so you, to get the best ending of the game, you have to put it up to level nine, which is the fastest speed, and high five, which means that you have junk blocks up to layer five of the screen. If you beat Mobit at all, you get a musical ending. And if it's the easiest mode, then you get, like, one person playing a little accordion. And if you put the difficulty to the highest, you get a whole musical set piece almost like you're at the theater with accordions and string instruments and percussions.

Jaymo (49:41): And and, Jen, is there a term for that Russian dance where you get low and kick your feet out?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (49:46): I mean, I call it the it's the gopak, like the Cossack dance. Yeah.

Jaymo (49:50): Yeah. Yeah. So beating it on level nine, high five, you get the most elaborate ending. So I'm definitely gonna play it for myself because I intend to beat this with liberal use of the rewind.

Unknown Speaker (50:01): I'm in computer.

Unknown Speaker (50:04): Mike, you want the sound effect or not?

Mike (50:06): I don't I don't think so because, like, I'm trying to remember how much I went through b on the because b on this and the NES are pretty similar.

Unknown Speaker (50:14): They are. They

Mike (50:15): are. And I'd started with the NES, so I didn't put put as much on this one.

Jaymo (50:19): Okay. Well, great segue into Tetris on the NES. Jen, you said that as a young babysitter, you spent many a late night with this game. What did you like about the TV version?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (50:31): I mean, bigger screen, obviously. It was so nice to actually sit down there and my babysitting charges had a projection screen TV. Oh. So I got to play it on a nice large screen. And, you know, I I did appreciate that there was color, but I didn't love it as much as I thought I

Unknown Speaker (50:51): would. Okay.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (50:52): Because I'm I'm like Mike, where for me, it was really like because for me, Tetris started on the Game Boy, so I became very much visually associated with the shapes of the blocks and not so much the color. But I loved the fact that I was able to play it on a much bigger screen, and I did like the fact that there was some musical variety in this one too.

Jaymo (51:09): Yeah. I I do think in defense of the color, I enjoyed how every time you would go up a level and it got more difficult, you get the satisfying, like, ding ding sound effect, and the colors would and they would all make a new shade. And, like, the color combinations are all very pleasing to the eye. Like, it's Not all.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (51:27): I didn't like the all purple one. Like, the purple y pink one hurt my eyes. It hurt my eyes.

Jaymo (51:32): Joy Con though, like, I mean, like you said, at the time, big advantage to have this on the big home screen Mhmm. Television. But now, like, on the Switch, like, I can get the Game Boy version on the big television. Right. Like, that's not really a thing anymore.

Jaymo (51:48): And in fact, I play my Switch mostly handheld, so this is kind of a smaller screen because you have the frames because the, you know, the proportions of the Tetris board are the same as the Game Boy version. Right? It's still 10 across and however many tall. So they were like, what else are we gonna put on the screen to fill the space? I'll give them statistics.

Jaymo (52:07): Let them know how many of each block they've had. I'm like, who does Mike, you're a you're a number guy. Does that does that do it for you?

Mike (52:14): Actually, the one of the rounds I was playing this, I was staring at it be like, the heck is going on because I needed a square, and I got relatively far with just none of them. And I'm looking at that, I'm like He's like, how how do I have, like, eight of every other piece and no squares? This isn't this is ridiculous.

Jaymo (52:35): I mean, you always think people are screwing you over, so you finally had proof. You had the receipts. Yeah.

Mike (52:39): It's it's the point actually where I started to be like, I wonder because I do not know, and I did not look into this, is I don't know if modern Tetris is random or pseudo random, and I feel like it may be random pseudo random Okay. In the idea of humans don't understand probability correctly.

Unknown Speaker (52:59): You say humans like you're not among us.

Unknown Speaker (53:01): No. No. No. I am as well. This is just and so this is gonna be a weird tangent.

Mike (53:06): There there's a bit off one of those, like, person solves crimes using math things where they were trying to find a serial killer, and they're like, we had no idea where he's based. These killings are just randomly scattered throughout the city. And then the person was like, alright. I want everybody to randomly spread out in this room. And what everyone did was spread out equally distant from one another.

Mike (53:29): And, again, that's not actually random. That's what people think is random. And in the same vein here, actual randomness means that you will end up with clumps, sometimes very weird clumps. Yeah. And I am curious as to whether or not later Tetris' are still the next piece can really be any piece or if there is some overarching thing where it's something instead where you go, we're gonna take, you know, three copies of each piece and then just shuffle them, and that's gonna be your order.

Mike (54:02): So at the end, it's equally distributed, and then you just repeat that. And you can come up with ways so that you don't have a, why am I getting absolutely none of one piece for a long stretch?

Jaymo (54:12): Right. I'm surprised that's possible because, like, gameplay wise, that's not great. If you're just being randomly denied that piece that you really need for a good run.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (54:20): If there's like an algorithm where it's like, okay. The game has dropped so many l pieces, but it hasn't dropped a square in, say, like, the last 30 pieces or whatever. Like, we get to that point where it's like, okay. I've seen too many of this.

Mike (54:33): Yeah. And it's just just it is super easy to do the true randomness. It may not be as well balanced, and, you know, it results in people being very frustrated. There's a modern game that captures this surprisingly well that's designed and comments on how people don't get how probability works called unfair flips. And it is a roguelite where you just flip a coin, and you are trying to get 10 heads in a row.

Mike (54:59): And you start off with a coin that is on it's an unfair coin, and so it only has heads 20% of the time. So you're powering up its chance of get coming up heads. And just as you're flipping the coin, some of the text they put in is just like they acknowledge, like, there is a chance somebody beats this game in their first 10 flips. It's not that likely, but it's also not it's not so remote as it can't happen. And it's like, yeah.

Mike (55:23): No. This is this is and the flip side, there's no guarantee you actually win. Theoretically, you could just be really unlucky and never beat it because you just don't get the right flips. I know all about unfair flips because of Pokemon trading card game. Conclusion to that is I kind of like paying attention to the statistics to see how that was going.

Jaymo (55:44): There we go. Now we're back to Tetris. Okay. Jen, the Tetris NES had a new classical piece not in the Game Boy, Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy by oh, Piotr?

Unknown Speaker (55:56): We just say Tchaikovsky. We just call Peter Tchaikovsky. That's what we say. Yeah.

Jaymo (56:01): Any feelings about old sugar plum and how it connects to Tetris?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (56:05): I mean, this is sort of like a double dose of childhood nostalgia when you're when you've got Sugar Plum Fairy because that's in Nutcracker. Right? So I'm sure anyone of our generation can be like, at some point, you either went on a school trip or grandma took you to see the Nutcracker on holidays. So this is probably something that, you know, you remember from being a kid and then pairing it with Tetris. What I like about this so this is music choice one in the NES version, not which we all know as being the main theme.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (56:33): So but what I like about this is that it is unmistakably Russian because it's from a Russian composer, Russian ballet. But it's this neat sort of like late eighties ass like teched up version of the Sugar Plum Fairy. So it's got this really neat sort of, like, all these, like, cool arpeggios over top, and it kinda turns into this nice little, like, tech jam, which I dig. And so that was usually it would it would be either this one or or music two, which is music b that was also in the Game Boy version that that, made up Doomka written by the staff at Nintendo.

Unknown Speaker (57:05): Just to clarify, music two in the NES and and b on the Game Boy are the same thing? Is that what I just

Jennifer Miller Hammel (57:10): They're the exact same one, but one is one is a little bit faster than the other. But it's the same it's the same composition. It's just a different arrangement. But, yeah, it comes from that, that same composer who's I wanna make sure I say his name correctly. Hirokazo Tanaka from Nintendo's, sound design team.

Unknown Speaker (57:25): So I brought a music person. Yeah. I did not realize that those are the same bits.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (57:29): Yeah. Yeah. So it's the same it's the same one. And, yeah, and it's just weird because you have this version. Like, they put these so this one comes out in November '89.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (57:39): So just, you know, a few months after the Game Boy version, but again, doesn't have Coral Byniki in it. It has Sugar Plum Fairy. So I don't know if maybe that was a way for them to sort of, like, put a stamp on the different versions. Like, we're gonna have two very, very Russian pieces of music, but they're going to be different. Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (57:56): And so and so you've got you've that. You have music two, which is the same as music b from the Game Boy version. And then you've got music three, which is this very, like, atmospheric it almost reminds me of something because this was another original piece, and I couldn't track down online, who wrote it. They just said it was someone from Nintendo's, music team. It could have been Tanaka.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (58:21): It could have been something that were you know, somebody that worked for Tanaka. I don't know. But it almost sounds like something out of an underwater level from, like like, the original Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles game or, like, from a later Mario game. It just it sounds and and that one just annoyed me. I didn't like it.

Unknown Speaker (58:38): I just felt like it just wasn't exciting enough. It was a little too loosey goosey. I was like, I need something that's got more of a pulse to it for for what I'm doing.

Mike (58:45): I I'm gonna use very bad words and hope that you can hone in on to me, it has a weird sort of rounded wooden sound to it.

Unknown Speaker (58:56): Yeah. Yeah. That's fair. I hear that.

Unknown Speaker (58:58): Can you explain that in a way that, like, sounds intelligent? Because, like, I have, like, I don't understand how to like, I'm explaining it with words that I don't feel like music words.

Unknown Speaker (59:06): I mean, for me, when I when I think of that, it just it feels to me like it's not static, but it's almost like it's too nice. It's just like it's not exciting enough. It's too relaxed.

Unknown Speaker (59:20): It's pastoral kind of.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (59:22): Yeah. Exactly. It's it's too it for me, it was a melody that, like, I had forgotten about it till I went back to play this version, and then I, like, really, like, listened to the music. And I'm going, oh god. Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (59:35): I remember this melody now. But it to me, it just it felt forgettable. Because, yeah, when I think of this version of Tetris, I think of Sugar Plum Fairy. Yeah. And then the awful color schemes that I didn't care for.

Mike (59:47): It just doesn't capture the energy.

Unknown Speaker (59:49): No. Exactly. It's just like, do do do do do do do do do do And it's just like it was just too it was too nice. It was too too, like, abstract, I guess, in some ways, like, a in a not and I like abstract music, so I know don't wanna put that down. But this this this to me just felt a little too it was not Russian.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:00:08): Like, to me, it it needed it needed another either classical piece like the Bach that you get in the Game Boy version, or it needed to have that sort of feeling like music two does.

Unknown Speaker (1:00:18): It kinda feels detached from the gameplay and from the theming.

Unknown Speaker (1:00:22): So it's

Jaymo (1:00:22): kinda like not really that. I got so excited when Mike was like, I'm gonna use bad words, but he didn't. Okay. So I also think in my covered not having what we associate as the Tetris theme is a big loss. And people are like, why did they cut it?

Jaymo (1:00:36): It's like, no. They developed these games concurrently.

Unknown Speaker (1:00:38): Yeah.

Jaymo (1:00:39): Like, you know, we just didn't know that do you say it?

Unknown Speaker (1:00:43): Corobainiki.

Jaymo (1:00:44): Was gonna set the world on fire and become everyone's favorite song. Yeah. And but, also, it's interesting because this game does not have a two player mode, whereas the Game Boy one had the link cable. Interestingly enough, there is a unfinished two player mode that you can access using Game Genie, but it's really disorienting because it's the two players on the one screen, but there's no visual separation between your two boards. So it looks like you should be able to go all the way over, but it's treated separately.

Jaymo (1:01:11): Then it's in the source code, like, of the cartridge. Using the Game Genie, you can still access it. So you feel like with just a few more weeks of development, we really could have had a much better version on the NES. Anything else to say in praise or criticism of NES Tetris before we compare high scores?

Mike (1:01:28): Do we want to go through the long diversion about what a high score in in this game is now?

Jaymo (1:01:34): I thought you said we counted lines in marathon mode. That's what that's what my high score is.

Mike (1:01:39): Okay. I well, I was gonna bring up that this has been the Tetris version that has gotten the most attention in terms of community attempts to break records. Right. So one thing that's notable to that is because you talked about liking the colors because they're all easy to look at, and they aren't at a point. And so this do you have a whole section planned on this, or can I divert?

Unknown Speaker (1:02:08): No. I don't know what you're talking about. Do it.

Mike (1:02:09): Okay. So Tetris on the NES was treated as having a kill screen at level 29 for most of the time that Tetris has existed. However, unlike other games that had kill screens, I think we've I think we talked about Donkey Kong's kill screen in that episode. And, like, Pac Man's kill screen is very famous where, like, the game breaks. The NES kill screen was you simply can't move fast enough at level 29 using normal human approaches.

Mike (1:02:44): You hold left on the d pad, it can only move so fast, and 29 is where that breaks. And so for a long time, the challenge was or it was basically that is the the point where a game ends is 29. You can't you just can't move the pieces fast enough. They speed up beyond what you can handle. And so much of the game became who could be the first person to max out the score, which people were getting done in, like, 20 level 25, level 26, level 27 if you're really good.

Mike (1:03:13): And so that's basically, it maxes out at a million. People were able to push through that a few levels when a Japanese player who had played on the Game Boy started playing and this all would have been, like, the late later twenty tens, I think. Like, all all of this is, like, within the last ten to fifteen years of Tetris advancement because he had played on the Game Boy. And on the Game Boy, you basically are tapping left and right. You're not you don't hold down.

Mike (1:03:41): The piece just moves. He'd gotten really good at tapping really fast, what they refer to as hyper tapping, and was actually able to get past what everyone else had treat been treating as a kill screen and could get into, like, the low thirties or something. And, effectively, all of this started hitting points where, like, developers clearly didn't think that you'd reach this. At the point where the score no longer works, you're at the point where they didn't really expect anyone to be playing. Then someone developed a technique called rolling.

Jaymo (1:04:08): Right. That's where you hold down the d pad and tap the other end of the controller against your

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:04:12): You hold it in a certain way because I've seen I've seen this at competitions. Yeah. You you hold the old NES controller in a certain way in order to, like, roll.

Jaymo (1:04:22): You're using kind of like inertia, right, Mike, to kinda Mhmm.

Mike (1:04:26): Yeah. I think it's also that you're a lot you're spreading out to instead of having to be like you're using one finger to tap a lot, you're using your whole other hand.

Unknown Speaker (1:04:33): Yeah.

Mike (1:04:35): Okay. Like, they've got gloves on and all kinds of

Unknown Speaker (1:04:38): Yeah. It's a whole thing.

Mike (1:04:39): It's insane. It's fascinating, but it's insane in the most positive way possible. And that allowed them to suddenly go from, like, okay. Now we're up to, like, level 32 or level 33 and just blew the doors open, which led to, at some point, those color schemes. Like, they're designed for the first many levels of you know, it's designed up.

Mike (1:04:59): You get to this level. These are the these are the color schemes. And that's having to pull from somewhere on memory. And as you start getting to higher levels and things start breaking, it starts pulling the like, what what are the colors supposed to be from places that don't contain that information.

Unknown Speaker (1:05:15): So what happens to the game?

Mike (1:05:17): So because ultimately, all it's doing is it's reading a location and treat it as it's a couple it's some set of numbers that tell you what color it should be. Sure. All the code is just some set of numbers. True. So when it starts pulling other locations, it just starts doing other colors.

Mike (1:05:33): And so there's a couple spots, and people have figured this out. Like, oh, this is gonna become a problem later on, is, like, level one thirty eight is where the colors start breaking. And this is, like, normally, it's, like, 10 every 10 lines, you're in a new level. You get up to level one forty six, which is called dusk. And, like, the first person that hit it lost real fast because he's like, I can't see the squares anymore.

Unknown Speaker (1:05:58): I'm looking at it right now. They're black.

Mike (1:06:01): They're they're really, really dark. There's another one called charcoal, which is one forty eight, and now we're at scores, I think, that are in the millions. Right. That is basically just black. Right.

Mike (1:06:15): And we're gonna say, like, shades of black, not grayscale. It's just it's shades of black. And so you can see it, but it's really, really, really tough. Right. And then you get one level in there where things are coded wrong, and it's all this ugly shade of green, and it's, like, 810 lines long because there's a bug in the code.

Mike (1:06:32): So instead of being 10 lines, it's like it's this massive stretch. And so this is all they've broken well past what for most of this game, anyone thought humans could do. And and keep in mind, every time there's been, like, a new, how do we get past this? It was you can't move fast enough for this, or you can't really see the squares here. Those are all ultimately, humans aren't good enough.

Mike (1:06:54): Level one fifty five is the first time you reach the kill screen. Everything up till then, and all of this comes from an amazing, like, two hour summoning salt video that will be linked, is people realized at one fifty five, you reach the first point in the game where the game can crash, where it fails at being able to update the score when you clear a clear a line. And there's some whole weird probabilities of which things that'll happen, which. And so just a couple years ago and then you you'd mentioned his name earlier was Blue Scooty

Unknown Speaker (1:07:31): Blue Scooty. Yeah.

Mike (1:07:32): Who was the first person to get the kill screen. Again, to coming back to that thing of you don't win Tetris, you just delay losing a Tetris, was the first one where, no, Tetris lost, not him, if you wanna frame it that way.

Unknown Speaker (1:07:48): Yeah.

Mike (1:07:49): And so that's yeah. Why did say that? Level one fifty five. Slightly more recently, like, in 2024. So I think he might have done that, like, late twenty twenty three.

Mike (1:07:59): Massive explosion on this stuff

Unknown Speaker (1:08:03): Yeah.

Mike (1:08:03): Was rebirth, which was that they basically realized if you keep going, because of how it's storing your level, if you can pass level two fifty five, the next level is level one. You're back at the start. You're reborn. And so to do that, you have to get past the section of the game where it can crash, which means you have to avoid it. And it's things like if the first line you clear on the level is a single line, it'll crash.

Mike (1:08:33): But if it's a if it's two lines, it won't kind of things. So there's this whole minefield there. So that was dog playing Tetris. In ninety minutes, was able to effectively loop the game back around and got, like, 29,000,000 points in the process. You know why I

Unknown Speaker (1:08:50): love you, Mike? Because I was like, I like the colors.

Mike (1:08:52): And you're like, no. Because if you play like a god and get 15,000,000 points, the colors become impossibly ugly. It's this amazing thing of how and it's fascinating because, effectively, things start breaking, but nothing breaks too much. Right. And because this is all relatively recent, like, I like, Tetris World Championships have been in Pasadena in the last couple years.

Mike (1:09:16): And I think I've had a conference at the same time, which has been really annoying because it means it's like, oh, this would be really cool. I have to be in a different state right now.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:09:24): The first weekend of June, they have it as part of the Pasadena Retro Game Con because I got to go last year, and I got to see Blue Scootie actually play. Wow. They had this whole thing where you could register. It was a fundraiser, and you could register into group tournaments and try to beat Blue Scooty at Tetris. And it was great.

Unknown Speaker (1:09:44): And I I should note, he was, like, 13 or 14 when he did it,

Unknown Speaker (1:09:47): I think.

Unknown Speaker (1:09:47): He was 13.

Jaymo (1:09:48): Yeah. 13. And, Janet, that Tetris championship, did they play, like, any Tetris music, like a live performance or anything?

Unknown Speaker (1:09:54): So and that's and that's, like, one of those missed opportunities that I'm trying to correct.

Unknown Speaker (1:09:58): Yeah. That's that's that's a crime.

Mike (1:10:00): Yeah. There's a much longer video about Ollie's, but it it's absolutely fascinating. Because I think, like, when he did that, there was someone else who had been going for it as well. Like, had just finished, got told in chat, hey. Someone else is almost there.

Mike (1:10:14): And just kind of like, and we're just gonna watch him.

Jaymo (1:10:17): So I'm not quite that good, Mike. I cleared 56 lines in game a. So almost blue scooty levels.

Mike (1:10:26): I I cleared in my playing the last couple days, I cleared 98.

Jaymo (1:10:30): Okay. Okay. Jen, any memory of your highest line count in Tetris NES?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:10:36): On this one, no. I probably I can I I do have memories of going, I just really wish I was playing the Game Away one? You know?

Jaymo (1:10:42): Yeah. Yeah. I've had that thought too. But did either of you ever beat Tetris NES?

Mike (1:10:49): No. I mean, not on not on a. Yes on b. Okay. Are we giving you

Jaymo (1:10:55): the sound effect? Was it the highest, most difficult form, level nine, high five?

Mike (1:11:01): It was not. I think I I think I did five, but I didn't do I didn't set the difficulty up to nine.

Jaymo (1:11:05): I wanna play it for you. You got to the end of it though.

Unknown Speaker (1:11:08): Let me know.

Unknown Speaker (1:11:09): I'm in computer.

Jaymo (1:11:11): At the most difficult level of level b, you get a really fun kinda Smash Brothers esque cut scene.

Unknown Speaker (1:11:17): Oh, hey.

Unknown Speaker (1:11:17): Look at Sam is playing the cello.

Unknown Speaker (1:11:19): Isn't that cute, James? Have you

Unknown Speaker (1:11:20): seen this before? No. I've never seen this.

Jaymo (1:11:22): Yeah. So when you finish mode b, you get another musical performance, but this time it's Nintendo characters. And the more difficult your task was, the more Nintendo cameos you get. So Nice. You got Donkey Kong with the drum, Pit with looks like a violin, Bowser with the accordion, Samus with the cello, Link with some kind of flute, then Mario and Luigi kinda doing the fun dance as pieces of Saint Basil's or Basil?

Unknown Speaker (1:11:48): Basil. Saint

Jaymo (1:11:49): Basil's Saint Basil's Cathedral pieces of it start flying off. So then let's quickly go through the third game, Tetris DX, released on the Game Boy Color in 1998. Big differences this time. You have a new mode called Ultra, which sets a three minute timer, and it's just a score attack. How how fast can you get?

Jaymo (1:12:08): Versus mode has also been improved. You now have this handy dandy bar on the left hand side that shows you the highest block of your opponent. So you kind of get a sense without looking now, Jen, you said the Game Boy Link cable was only, like, two feet long. So it wouldn't be hard to just lean over and look at their screen. But now without looking away, you can get a sense of how they're doing.

Jaymo (1:12:29): And this was the game where you can finally t spin. And to me, that's what makes this the best playing Tetris. T spinning is the technique where once your piece makes contact with a block or the floor, you can still rotate it. You can spin against the surface, whereas NES and Game Boy, it would stick. And so it really opens up a lot of strategies, and it lets you kinda maneuver your block kinda like a worm going through a tunnel if you're good enough at it.

Jaymo (1:12:59): And then, you know, there's some fun cut scenes in marathon mode they added. Because all the Tetris games have sort of this space race kinda theming, and the idea is, like, the better you're doing, the better your space program will be. And so this one really leans into that Jen said the space shuttle on the cover. So if you if you do better and better, your shuttle gets better and better in the final cut scene. But there's some fun ones, like one is a big champagne bottle.

Jaymo (1:13:23): And so, like, the champagne bottle will take off, but then the cork will poo and shoot up. There's a Statue Of Liberty one where, like, her skirt kinda blows up with rocket fire, which seems a little, like, kinda mocking of The US, which I kind of appreciated, to be honest with you. And then my one that kinda made me gasp. I don't know. I'm a cheap date, Jen.

Jaymo (1:13:42): Okay? I'm really easy to please. The final cut scene, if you get the best rocket, the you you it the the shuttle actually breaks orbit. And now you're in space, and then it in it turns upside down and starts dumping the tetrama nose. And I was like, oh, are these pieces from space?

Jaymo (1:13:59): Is this like a cannon that the we've been receiving blocks from the spaceship? Because I always thought it was just I never actually thought of the idea of where the blocks are coming from. I never imagined this as, like, a physical event happening until it was in the cutscene.

Unknown Speaker (1:14:14): I mean, that's that's a better interpretation of what the blocks are than other things have done.

Unknown Speaker (1:14:19): Yeah. Yeah. Like, your review.

Mike (1:14:20): I I was thinking, in Captain n, they're people?

Jaymo (1:14:24): Yes. Yeah. Mayor Squaresley, as the Still Loading podcast, likes to remember.

Mike (1:14:28): Which does mean that, like, when you complete rows, that actually is highly ethically questionable.

Jaymo (1:14:34): Okay. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. You're cleansing the row almost.

Jaymo (1:14:40): But so, Jen, correct me if I'm wrong though. The music in this, it's no longer classical. It's all, like, new kinda techno songs.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:14:47): Yeah. It's like all these nineties jams sort of things or, like, nineties style, like, trying to be okay. So what it reminded me of just in general, this is sort of my blanket statement for music in this game. It reminds me of, like, when a kid's show or, like, a family sitcom is trying to be hip. And they're trying to do, like, do their own version of something that's really street or really funky or you know?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:15:18): And and that's kind of it was like a square version. I mean, I guess it works for Tetris, but it was sort of like a very square version of, like, what nineties hip hop was supposed to sound at this point because, you know, we're also at, like, the tail end of the nineties here at this point too. So, yeah, it's kind of like what I would imagine, like, someone like like a boomer trying to write nineties hip hop was kind of what this reminded me of.

Jaymo (1:15:41): It's that that that flavor is kind of all over the game. Like, the you win and lose, it kinda looks like graffiti. And, like Yeah. I don't know if you caught it because I obnoxiously rotated the covers in our earlier box art description or discussion, I mean. But, like, it's Tetris DX, but the DX of Deluxe looks like it's written with a Sharpie.

Unknown Speaker (1:15:59): Oh, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (1:15:59): It's the bad boy of the Tetris family. Right. So it's like so I'm

Jaymo (1:16:03): like, okay. But, you know, it does it kinda bums me up because it's like, technically, game plays better, but it just it loses something.

Mike (1:16:12): The scene music had this vaguely jazz esque feel Yeah. To me.

Unknown Speaker (1:16:17): Yeah. Yeah. I think that was the best of the three.

Unknown Speaker (1:16:19): That that's the best of the three tracks, think.

Mike (1:16:20): And what I did find weird, I wasn't prepared for since with the previous, we're just like, okay. I'm running out of space. You know, the music speeds up. Here, the music just straight up, like, changes. Mhmm.

Unknown Speaker (1:16:32): Yeah. Yeah.

Mike (1:16:33): And it feels like more of a distraction because it feels more like the music's changed tracks rather than, like, the music is just matching what's going on. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (1:16:46): And it's not like a subtle segue. It's just like it's very jarring. It's like, oh god.

Jaymo (1:16:50): Yeah. Yeah. It's it's the cleverness of making the music speed up. Don't know if Tetris was the first thing to do that, but, like, it is simulate or emulating the

Unknown Speaker (1:16:59): bead Space invaders actually was the

Unknown Speaker (1:17:01): first There you go. There you Yeah. Although, Mike, that that was like a glitch, wasn't it? That sped the game up.

Unknown Speaker (1:17:07): Yeah. It just processed it. It just Processes faster. Yeah. There's fewer things.

Unknown Speaker (1:17:11): It processes them faster. It speeds up automatically.

Unknown Speaker (1:17:13): Right. Right.

Jaymo (1:17:13): But it's just so effective. Like, just and the feeling of just listening to classical music and the tempo is increasing, and it's, like, know, happening in the opera and the audience, like, you're getting it's it really connects you to the moment. Do we have anything else that we liked or disliked specifically about Tetris DX?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:17:32): I I mean, I can say something I I did like about it. And again, this is more of a nostalgia thing. The color palette is that very, like, nineties muted pastel sort of thing, like

Unknown Speaker (1:17:41): Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:17:42): Like, the art direction on Star Trek, The Next Generation.

Unknown Speaker (1:17:44): Sure.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:17:45): That's kind of, like, what I get off of it. So this I actually didn't mind the color scheme

Unknown Speaker (1:17:50): Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:17:50): So much. But yeah. But, yeah, I think just, like, in general, the whole thing felt like it was trying too hard.

Jaymo (1:17:57): I I noticed that too, though. Like, the borders have kinda, like, plaid sort of, like, skater sort of feel to it. You know? And so, you know, I don't I'm not mad at it, but it's just missing something.

Mike (1:18:09): It does just feel like I just would like honestly, the music from either of the previous two.

Jaymo (1:18:14): Yeah. And you lose the Nintendo connections. The cut scenes no longer have Nintendo cameos. When we played two player versus, it wasn't Mario versus Luigi. We didn't have any kind of character representing us.

Jaymo (1:18:25): So I was like, you know, it was kinda more fun earlier. Okay. High score twenty eight years ago. Marathon record, Mike. I got I did a little bit better on this one.

Jaymo (1:18:34): I got to 95 lines, and then the tomato soup on the stovetop started to burn. So I had to pause the game, tend to my tomato soup. Have you ever paused Tetris and then tried to jump back in when it's moving quickly? It is Jen, it's impossible. Like, I was like, this your brain cannot detach from this game.

Jaymo (1:18:52): Yeah. Yeah. So I think I could have done a little better if the tomato soup hadn't started to burn, but 95 was my record for this one. How'd you do? One forty seven.

Unknown Speaker (1:19:00): Okay. Oh. Whatever. Sure. Alright.

Jaymo (1:19:03): Alright, Blue Scooty. Okay. And so, Mike, did you ever beat Tetris DX?

Mike (1:19:09): Not at the highest level.

Jaymo (1:19:12): I got the most impressive fireworks show by using Rewind to get it at level nine high five. So big firework for me. Poof. But I, Nintendo, did beat Tetris DX.

Unknown Speaker (1:19:24): Nintendo. I'm in computer.

Jaymo (1:19:27): So last game for today, Tetris 99, released for Nintendo Switch online in 2019. You have this game Tetris for the Battle Royale era. Right? Fortnite, you have a hundred hundred players on this big island, and you're whittling it down Hunger Games style till there's one left. This is the Hunger Games of Tetris where you see on the sides of the screen 98 other opponents, and you can see actually their progress.

Jaymo (1:19:55): You see each individual player's tiny Tetrominoes, And then with the right joy so you're moving your blocks with the left d pad and the right joystick, you are targeting players. And you can actually either aim your cursor and target specific players, which I do not know who possibly has that kind of multitasking brain to do that. But the right stick, though, you can auto target you can either target randomly, you can target weak players, because if you send them blocks and it kills them, you get a KO to your record. And it's really sad.

Unknown Speaker (1:20:28): Like, it goes KO, and it's it feels really good.

Jaymo (1:20:31): You can target people who, if you defeat them, you'll get a badge for doing that. There's little in game achievements. Or my personal favorite, you can target who's ever attacking you. So you kinda defend yourself against all sides, and it's kinda thrilling. It plays really well even with all those other players connected to you in some way.

Jaymo (1:20:50): You have all the things I love from DX. You got the t spinning. You got this nice the Mike, you like these colors. Right?

Mike (1:20:57): You mean in particular or just those are definitely visible, which is something that some the NES ones did not do.

Jaymo (1:21:03): Alright. Do you like them better at least? But my favorite thing is that and I know other Tetris games that were more new than the ones we've talked about today did this, but you can see exactly where your block's gonna fall. They give you this little landing zone, and you see the silhouette of where your block and so it removes that anxiety of just fast dropping. Like, you know Jen, you don't you don't like that, do you, Jen?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:21:24): Feels like cheating. It feels like cheating. I'm just like, I kind of like the, you know, the excitement of, like, okay. See I where it's gonna line up. I'm figuring out visually in my head where it's gonna go.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:21:34): I don't like I don't like that it's telling me. I would rather just visualize it myself and use my own brain to

Jaymo (1:21:40): Yeah. See, I don't like my brain. I like cheating with rewinding. Came up

Unknown Speaker (1:21:44): in this. Did the fast dropping? Yes. Was that in all of these and I did not notice,

Unknown Speaker (1:21:49): or was it just Fast dropping? Yes. Well, do you can hold down down, but with this one, Jen, you can tap up on the d pad, and it'll teleport to the bottom.

Unknown Speaker (1:21:57): Oh, I see. Okay.

Jaymo (1:21:58): Yeah. It's instantaneous. And that's, like, high level players, like I mean, you gotta do that to beat this game. But I am not I am not nearly good enough, and I can't count the number of times I tried to insta drop and screwed it up. And that's the I hate that feeling.

Jaymo (1:22:12): To me, Tetris sometimes feels like, you know, the wait until you make one mistake you can't undo. And, like, that's just life. You know what I mean? Like, it's too real sometimes. But one thing that Tetris 99 does is that it regularly has in game events where it will theme the music and the background to different Nintendo franchises.

Jaymo (1:22:31): So we've had Splatoon, Fire Emblem, Kirby, Luigi's Mansion, Pokemon, Animal Crossing, Metroid, Super Mario Brothers, and f zero events. Quite the list, Jen, but you had to save one of these. What's your favorite of these Nintendo franchise as far as music?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:22:45): I mean, Luigi's Mansion is a jam. It's it's a jam. Yeah. I mean, I I really love when when I so I found this really cool orchestral version of the main theme and have it on arcade. And it's just one of my favorite things.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:23:00): If I happen to, like, tune into it and it comes up in that particular, like, chunk of the stream when I'm listening, I'm like, yeah. This is such a good such a good jam. Luigi getting that game that he finally needed. You know?

Jaymo (1:23:10): And then he hums the theme to, like, give himself and then and when he and when he gets scared, he'll it nervously. And it's like, it's so Nintendo, chef kiss Nintendo. So good. I I hard agree. I I love that.

Jaymo (1:23:24): They also added some new team battle modes. There's Tetris Invictus, which is a multiplayer lobby only with people who've gotten the Tetris Maximus victory. So if you're hardcore, you can play with only the best of the best. Mike, you're a big fan of this game.

Mike (1:23:39): I am not. Oh. You love f zero ninety nine, though. I think it's because to me, a racing game is inherently against people, and a puzzle game is against myself.

Jaymo (1:23:51): Oh, so you don't like the sabotage and the

Unknown Speaker (1:23:53): I see.

Jaymo (1:23:54): The it's it's it's less it's less pure in terms of math and gameplay for you.

Mike (1:24:00): Yeah. Because there there's a whole element to the this is the strategy I have and it's like other people mess with this.

Unknown Speaker (1:24:06): Yeah.

Mike (1:24:06): It's not a succeeding on my terms or losing on my terms.

Jaymo (1:24:11): Okay. See, I'm the kind of person where when I lose spectacularly, I laugh. That's why I love Mario the Lost Levels. Like, I think it's hilarious when I just get that screwed over. And so that's why I like this.

Jaymo (1:24:23): So my well, the one thing I don't like about Tetris 99 is that you can play online for free and the game's still being supported, which is beautiful. Like, Nintendo has no microtransactions in a game where they could absolutely make a ton of money using microtransactions.

Unknown Speaker (1:24:40): Yeah.

Jaymo (1:24:40): So they're leaving money on the table and not coming after kids who just, know, that that's good. That's a good thing. However, to play the offline modes to do marathon or local versus, you have to buy the $10 DLC. And that's weird because you get Tetris 99 for free with your subscription in Nintendo Switch online. And at the base level of that subscription, you have single player Tetris on the Game Boy and on the NES.

Jaymo (1:25:07): So why are you charging me for something that I already have technically? Like, you're just charging me $10 so that I don't have to boot up the other game? That's weird. And how much money did you make from that? Probably a lot.

Jaymo (1:25:20): People love Tetris. But I don't know. It's just a strange kinda nickel and dimey thing in a game that is otherwise very generous. So, Jen, I don't think you tried this one. No.

Jaymo (1:25:31): But did you have any opinions on it or the music in it?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:25:35): I mean, I I love the idea that they they kind of made a I I don't wanna say they overcorrected, but they definitely made a huge correction coming back from the Game Boy Color version where it had, you know, no Nintendo properties to having just every single major Nintendo property here. Although and please correct me if I'm wrong. There's no representation from Zelda in here. Is there?

Jaymo (1:25:57): I don't think so. Yeah. Leave a comment, but I think that's a weird blind spot.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:26:02): Yeah. I mean I mean, I to me, just looking at the list you've got here in the screen and then the list I made from, you know, my my research. Yeah. I think there's probably a missed opportunity there with no Zelda crossover stuff. But I do think I I especially with this game coming out in 2019 just ahead of the COVID pandemic, I think it was another great way for people to kind of play games with each other at a time when we couldn't hang out.

Unknown Speaker (1:26:27): Yeah.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:26:27): It was nice to have this option to have this game when we had other things like Fall Guys also, where you could just like get a bunch of strangers together and play a game. Although, let me ask you, did you were you actually able to get into matches where you had a full contingent of 99 people? Like, are are there enough people still playing?

Jaymo (1:26:45): It's hard to tell because at some point, they do just fill it with bots. Right. But, you know, you can kinda tell when the bots kick in because it's like boom, trickle trickle. 40 people just joined. It's like, okay.

Jaymo (1:26:56): What what happened? You know what I mean? So you can't really tell, but it feels like a lot of people are still playing this game.

Mike (1:27:02): They may well just do it differently. In f zero ninety nine, which is the same concept of get 90 people, you see sort of this trickle of other racers, and then once the clock is ran out, suddenly you'll just see half the field cut up. And it's like, okay.

Unknown Speaker (1:27:15): Right. The

Mike (1:27:16): back half was all bots. Yeah. This one, it would go, here's the amount of time, and it was filling real fast, which to me is either there's a lot of people or they are dynamically adjusting that and know there's not many people on. Mhmm. It won't make a difference if we give you an extra thirty seconds.

Mike (1:27:35): We're just gonna fill things in sort of more consistently so you don't notice that we're doing that.

Unknown Speaker (1:27:41): K.

Mike (1:27:41): Yeah. So they they've either engineered it really well so that you don't notice, or there's a lot of people playing.

Unknown Speaker (1:27:47): But it it feels like a well made game. Like, it it handled really solidly. It looks good. It sounds good. You got that Tetris theme back, the the Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (1:27:55): Coca notebook, whatever you called it.

Unknown Speaker (1:27:57): Korobainiki. But, yeah, it's like it's it's like a super EDM version of it.

Unknown Speaker (1:28:01): Yeah. Yeah. I'm into it. I'm here for it. So high score in seven years ago, Mike.

Jaymo (1:28:07): I don't think I can count the team battle I did with Jeremy before recording because we did a team battle of me and my army of 48 bots versus him and his army of 48 bots, and it came down to just the two of us. So I don't think I can say I've gotten second place since it wasn't in an actual online lobby. So my best placement in Tetris 99, I got to tenth. And I would have loved to get to single digits just to be able to say that, but that's the best I'd ever done. Mike, what was your do you know your highest Tetris 99 placement?

Unknown Speaker (1:28:37): Somewhere in the forties.

Unknown Speaker (1:28:39): Alright. You know what? Mike's Mike's one of the smartest guys I know, so I'm kinda happy that my Tetris scores and I can't rewind on this one. So that's like a legit tenth place, Jen. Like, I do I do have some value as a person.

Jaymo (1:28:50): Okay? I promise. Well, okay. So that brings us to the moment of truth. We've covered the joy pros, the joy cons, and every bit in between.

Jaymo (1:28:58): So it's now it's time to declare these four Tetris games as Nintendos or Nintendon'ts. Jen, can we have you give us your four rankings first?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:29:09): Yeah. Although I'm gonna leave out I'm gonna leave out Tetris 99 only because I actually didn't get my hands on that one. I'm gonna say Game Boy, Nintendoo, NES, Nintendoo, DX, Nintendo.

Unknown Speaker (1:29:23): Oh, no.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:29:25): And and for me, like, a lot of that, it's it's it's the music. I just

Unknown Speaker (1:29:29): Yep. You really lose something. Yeah. You lose it. I get it.

Unknown Speaker (1:29:32): I I I it's just to me, it's like Tetris DX is like the middle schooler of the group, and, like, I teach middle school. So I'm like, oh, buddy. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (1:29:40): You're you're trying. You'll get there someday. Yeah. Yeah. There yet.

Unknown Speaker (1:29:43): This is

Unknown Speaker (1:29:43): quite right. But

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:29:45): I I liked what it was what it did change technically, but I think overall as an experience, I would just rather go back and play the Game Boy or the NES versions.

Jaymo (1:29:53): Yeah. So for me, they're kinda weird to rank because, like, they're so similar. Right? But I think they're all Nintendos. I think that you can try these games in, what, two, three minutes, play a match.

Jaymo (1:30:08): So try the Game Boy. Try the Game Boy Color version. Try the NES one. See what your personal preference is before you boot up Tetris 99. Because don't pay $10 to play offline.

Jaymo (1:30:19): You already have that. Just try one of the older versions. They have a cool history to them. They have this iconic soundtrack to them. So take a minute to try all three.

Jaymo (1:30:26): And then when you're done, definitely try Tetris 99. I think it is definitely a Nintendo bordering on Super Nintendo. Like, I really like this game. Even though I am not good at it, that's always been my barometer is that if I can lose at a game spectacularly and I'm still having fun, that's a good game. If you have to be winning to have fun, I think the game design slipped somewhere.

Jaymo (1:30:50): So all Nintendos for me. Mike, what about you?

Mike (1:30:54): So I'm mostly gonna treat a group of these as one block, so to speak. With NES, Game Boy, and DX all kind of largely having the same core gameplay. One thing with DX that was disappointing was the second mode where instead of starting with a filled screen, it just moves the bottom of the screen up. Yeah. And that there's something there's something more fun about starting a mini, like, oh, two thirds of the screen is mostly full, and I can work my way down versus just, oh, no.

Mike (1:31:27): I just have less screen to work with. Yeah. But that aside, I would actually say I think it's more than a few minutes each. Because actually, like, one the things I definitely did, I probably put, like, three to four hours between the last two days in streaming and just rotating through the games was also rotating through the music. Because part of it is, you know, there is the, you know, the idea of like, yeah.

Mike (1:31:50): Well, this is the classic Tetris theme, but the other music all kind of did work to different levels. And getting to on the DX, I like the third one. Mhmm. If you just start with the first one and be like, okay. This isn't working.

Mike (1:32:02): It's impressive how much the music plays a role in this. Mhmm. But at the same time, I think just the core gameplay is so strong. Like, so much of what I of how I've played this had no music, and it worked. Yeah.

Mike (1:32:16): So it's very much there are games that I think the music can carry it in the same way I think that, you know, there's movies that the music carries a not good movie. Tetris really is, I think, is just it's such a robust core game mechanic that it works with that the music can be a very good addition. But if it's doing the gameplay right, the music can't elevate it much more because it's already such a solid game to me. And then there's Tetris 99. So to me, it is Nintendos for the first three, and I think I would also go Nintendon't on Tetris 99.

Unknown Speaker (1:32:53): Oh. Wow.

Jaymo (1:32:54): Okay. Well, that's exciting because with Jen not voting, that means it's a tie. So we get to throw it to our Disc Discord. Let us know. Join the Discord at www.theoldswitcharue.com and chime in on why Mike is wrong, and Tetris 99 is really fun.

Jaymo (1:33:10): And if you agree with him, go somewhere else. Well, so then let's get into our and standing rankings. Not Mike, not Jaymo, but the and in between. I personally lumped the first three games together at number 49 through 51 of what are we at, Mike? Like, a 104 by now or something like that?

Unknown Speaker (1:33:31): A 109.

Jaymo (1:33:32): 100 out of a 109 games, I ranked Tetris, Tetris DX, and Tetris on the NES, 49 to 51 right below Doctor Mario 64 and right above Telero boxer. And I put Tetris 99 a bit higher at 35 under Sonic Spinball, but above Mega Man. I think if I was better at Tetris, I think it'd go even higher, but I think those are really quality games. Mike, where did you place these games?

Mike (1:33:58): So I treating three of those times a block. I ended up going Tetris Game Boy, highest, then Tetris NES, then Tetris DX. Oh. Though the first two was I I think I actually switched that twice. And I have them between 14 to 16.

Mike (1:34:17): So right Wow. Wow. Below Contra Hardcore and above Mario Tennis.

Unknown Speaker (1:34:21): Yeah. Top 20.

Mike (1:34:23): And then Tetris 99 is between I have between Wario's Woods and Breath of Fire at 76.

Jaymo (1:34:29): K. Okay. I was worried you're gonna put those with some of our garbage fire games down towards the bottom. You seem to really be irked at Tetris 99, but I'm glad you don't hate it completely.

Mike (1:34:39): I I think it's it's less than I don't hate it. I just don't enjoy it. Like, it it doesn't have a thing to hook me back.

Jaymo (1:34:47): Okay. I'd rather be hated than just shrugged. So alright. So, Mike, will you let us know where these games landed on our mathematically combined listing?

Mike (1:34:57): Alright. So bottom working up. The lowest one was Tetris 99, which is at 55. It is right below Echo the Dolphin and above Solomon's Key and Super Mario Brothers.

Jaymo (1:35:11): Okay. Jen, Echo the Dolphin, any love for that? It's got really famous music.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:35:16): Yeah. I mean, I it was one of those games that I think probably worked better on the Genesis, but I never had a Genesis. But, yeah, no, I I always appreciated the aesthetic of that game, but I never really played it very much. So

Unknown Speaker (1:35:31): percent. Playing it, I can't play it very much and just enjoy the aesthetic.

Unknown Speaker (1:35:35): So Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (1:35:36): But some part of me does love that placement because, like, Solomon's Key, kind of a puzzle, Echo the Dolphin, kind of really stressful and frustrating. So there's something going on. And what about the other games?

Mike (1:35:45): So the other games, as we go up, they are unsurprising in a block because we both put them in blocks. Yeah. So I'm just gonna go through this chunk starting with number 36, Kirby's Adventure. Number 33 is a three way tie between Phantasy Star four, Super Mario World, and Tetris on the NES. Then right above that at 32 is Tetris DX.

Mike (1:36:11): Right above that is Tetris on the Game Boy, and then right above that at 30 is Mario's Picross. Very cool. Very cool.

Jaymo (1:36:21): So, guys, I think that's gonna wrap it up for today here. Gonna call it game over. Jennifer, you have been music to our ears. Before you disappear from the screen, why don't you tell our listeners where they can go if they want actual music in their ears?

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:36:34): Yes. If you wanna check out Classical California's arcade, you can find it through our different streaming choices at classicalcalifornia.org, or you can also download the classical California app, which is available for all mobile devices. You can listen to arcade in your car. It's great.

Jaymo (1:36:52): It's is indeed great. It sounds n e excellent. Everyone, join us next time for the action packed sequel to season three episode eight. We are covering Ninja Gaiden two and Super Ninja Boy for the NES and SNES, respectively. Also, don't forget to visit www.theoldswitcharue.com.

Jaymo (1:37:12): There you can find links to our Spotify, Discord, YouTube, TikTok, and all the social medias you can shake a joystick at. Big thanks to Crystal Fields for our incredible intro song. And please, dear listener, don't forget to like and subscribe. Every click means a lot, and you mean a lot to us. Until next time, this has been the old switcheroo.

Unknown Speaker (1:37:28): We've been talking gaming retro with Mike and J Mo. I've been Mike. And I've been J Mo. Game on, everyone. Looks like you have a little manifesto there.

Mike (1:37:50): Manifesto is a very good term for this. The ubiquitous the ubiquitous the ubiquitous I'm gonna Ubiquiti. Yeah. I'm gonna I'm just gonna end this and get this where I get this right. The ubiquity I

Unknown Speaker (1:38:08): wanna play it for you. You got to the end of it, though. You can't stop me. I'm playing the sound effect. I'm not playing the sound effect.

Unknown Speaker (1:38:16): I'm playing the sound effect. Wait. What's going on? I'm playing the sound effect.

Unknown Speaker (1:38:20): I'm gonna add it in post anyway so it doesn't matter. Bye.

Unknown Speaker (1:38:23): This never I swear this never happens again. Okay. What

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:38:29): I've loved about just, like, Tetris in general, I didn't get a chance to say this in the show, but, like, I love the fact that, like, the game was spread almost like in a viral fashion. Like it just got put on floppy disks and it just like passed around Russia and in Eastern Europe. And it kind of reminds me of something like, you know, like the Nine Inch Nails broken video that got like passed around on VHS or like Faces of Death, you know, something like that. And I just love how it went from sort of, like, this, like, humble beginnings of just becoming this viral sensation to, like, a businessman going, okay. I'm gonna steal this and make money off of it and sell it to Nintendo, and it becomes, like, this whole thing.

Jennifer Miller Hammel (1:39:03): But, you know, Alexei, he's still involved in in the history of Tetris, and he's getting a cut now. Thank goodness. But yeah.

Unknown Speaker (1:39:10): About time.

Mike (1:39:11): Yeah. I appreciate that somehow comparing Tetris to Faces of Death isn't the craziest Tetris take that we've discussed.

Unknown Speaker (1:39:18): There you go. There you go. Close second.